Kia Joorabchian further explains why Amo Racing horses left the Roger Varian yard

The story broke on Saturday with the Amo Racing chief giving a well-publicised interview to Matt Chapman on ITV Racing. Joorabchian expanded on the decision on Monday’s Nick Luck Daily Podcast, saying: “In racing, you have to realise there are a lot of people who currently own racehorses who are extremely wealthy individuals from the Middle East and other parts of the world.

“The financial structure of how they operate and the returns they get, what happens in regards to prize money, training fees etc, are things that nobody really wants to look at. Nobody really wants to look at the record of any individual trainer as an example and say, OK I had X amount invested and X amount returned, and this is what happened to the actual horses and this is where we are at currently.

“When you start talking about that kind of thing, subjects all get diverted. Unfortunately, where we come from as Amo, we have to look very carefully and very deeply into how we operate and how we can support the game with the situation we have in regards this lack of huge prize-money unless you get to the Group One phase. How can you sustain and balance that?

“So, when you have a trainer such as Roger Varian who is the golden boy of racing, the trainer to the stars - you walk around his yard, and he has Dubawis, Frankels and Kingmans coming out from every corner - there is no point in giving him a horse that is going to run at Wolverhampton or potentially not make it, so you have to end up running in smaller tracks in the evening in order to win races and potentially sell on.

“Because you have to understand also that people like Roger Varian charge a lot more daily rate than a smaller trainer would, so when I went back to Roger from the very first day I said, ‘I only want to give you good horses, that is my thesis for you, otherwise it doesn’t make sense’.

“I understand he has very important, big owners and I understand I am a very, very small fish in his pond and that he might not have all the time in the world for me or might not be able to give me the time and moments I need from him because has these huge owners.

"So therefore, there's no point in me throwing at him ten two-year-olds and ask him to work out which one is going to come out on top. So, when we went back, and we always had a good relationship albeit a slightly distant one because he has huge owners and we’re a small fish in the pond, when we went back and sat down and had a conversation and that was the agreement.

"I said, 'look I’ll give you a pick of my best ones and you decide which ones suit you', so much so that last year for example I sent him to my Lambourn yard, I asked him to go there and pick four or five horses he thought would be his calibre of horses.

“He did that, picked his four of five horses, and that’s where we ended up having King Of Steel and three or four others with him."

Joorabchian insisted he didn’t blame the trainer in any way for the setback that has ruled his QIPCO Champion Stakes winner out for a chunk of the current campaign.

“In no way can you apportion any responsibility onto anybody. Remember, I work in sport and see injuries and situations all the time. Big, big players who made big transfers and unfortunately a big injury like a cruciate ligament would occur and unfortunately you go damn, that’s the whole season gone. I’m quite understanding of that and never put any blame on anybody."

The owner insists, too, that the decision didn’t stem from a huge fallout with Varian.

“I never had a fallout with Roger, we had an incident pre-the King Of Steel injury which Roger apologised profusely several times for, I let that go," he revealed.

“It didn’t fracture the relationship. Roger, the following morning, apologised to me and then continued to apologise to me and I accepted it and we moved on. King Of Steel unfortunately then got injured a few days later so the timing of it all was a little bit off.

"That incident remains private. I appreciate Roger realised what had gone wrong and apologised to me for it. Roger is a trainer to the stars – we are a very, very small outfit compared to the calibre and level of the people who he has.

"I have to respect the fact that I’m never going to be an important figure there. I never ask for control our autonomy, you can probably call all of my trainers, I don’t think I’ve ever fallen out with a trainer."

Joorabchian feels his reputation in some quarters for moving horses around and changing retained jockeys, is an unfair one.

“You often see or hear people saying ‘oh he’s moving horses around’. I don’t really move horses around. Last year we had one very big owner move a stable of 15 or 20 horses out of George Boughey’s and no one made a big thing about that,” he went on.

“Another owner moved 20-odd horses out of one and moved them to Karl Burke. Lots of people changed jockeys last year, James Doyle left Godolphin, Andrea Atzeni left Sheikh Obaid, there were thousands of things happening and it just so happens if we ever do something there’s more of a light on us because we are the new kid on the block and I understand that.

“I have horses with all the trainers who I started with. George Boughey, who I love and think is a brilliant trainer, George Scott, Dave Loughnane. I started with horses with Kevin Phillipart De Foy and we’ve gone through ups and downs in terms of having horses and not having horses but we’ve always kept them in some shape with him.

“Ralph Beckett, who I think is a sensational trainer and one of the best, Richard Hannon I love and I’ve always had lots of horses with him, Charlie Hills too. Everybody who we have always started with we’ve tried to continue. There may be phases when we don’t have a horse with a particular yard. For example this year, we don’t have a horse with Alice (Haynes) but by no means does that mean I have any upset with her or anything. I will have horses with her in the future, I hope.

“I’ve never ever had a scenario where I’ve fallen out with a trainer. For us as a business, we need to make economic sense, unfortunately we don’t have a country behind us, ten billionaires behind us, we don’t have that kind of autonomy.

“It must make economic sense and the horses that I moved from Roger were two-year-olds that were not excelling yet and that makes no economical sense. Keeping a lead horse such as Forca Brasil that will do nothing other than being a lead horse for King Of Steel, makes no economical sense to keep there.

“Unfortunately, Ornellaia had a virus and subsequently she’s quite fragile so we made the decision that Newmarket would not be the best place for her. We do it often. George Boughey said the other day ‘these two horses are no good for Newmarket you should move them’.

“We have a very good relationship as a team and with our trainers so that when we do move horses, we talk it through. It’s not like I wake up in a morning and say, ‘this lot will have to move now because I’m not happy with the guy’.

“With Roger, I think you should ask him not me but what I can tell you is I’m grateful to him. I know he is a very big trainer. I’m grateful to him for the Champion Stakes, one of the greatest days for me and the team at Amo, with Frankie and everything.

“It was one of the best days of racing in my life and I’ll always be grateful to him and his staff but not having two-year-olds that are not excelling at a cost of what it is to keep them at Mr Varian’s compared to the cost of keeping them at a different yard like our own training yard in Lambourn for example is something we have to consider and injured horses are the same.”

So is the temptation there to just build up the numbers at the private stables and cut down on those that are trained elsewhere?

“The likes of Godolphin and Coolmore have done that and we may end up in a day when we will have a lot more horses in our private yard. But I do love having horses with the trainers that I mentioned before. This year, we started a relationship with Charlie Johnston and I’m looking forward to that and Richard Fahey who did a fantastic job with very limited resources from us last year," he added.

“I enjoy having horses with other trainers, but I have also spoken to all of them and we all agree it has to make economic sense. If a a horse isn’t good enough what’s the point in keeping him there at £75 or £80 a day? The number of horses we have in training, our outgoing becomes a very hefty number.

“Of course, if you’re a multi-billionaire, and it doesn’t make much of a difference, it’s a different story, but we’re not so we have to try and make it economically function in some form or shape which means cutting our losses to moving to a smaller trainer with smaller fees because the horse just doesn’t have Group One potential.”

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